Global sales of XBox are so bad developers wonder if supporting the console is worth it for them

https://www.polygon.com/24108670/xbox-epic-games-store-phil-spencer-interview

Spencer mentioned his frustrations with closed ecosystems, so we asked for clarity. Could he really see a future where stores like Itch.io and Epic Games Store existed on Xbox? Was it just a matter of figuring out mountains of paperwork to get there?

“Yes,” said Spencer. “[Consider] our history as the Windows company. Nobody would blink twice if I said, ‘Hey, when you’re using a PC, you get to decide the type of experience you have [by picking where to buy games]. There’s real value in that.” Spencer believes console players would benefit from that freedom too — and so would console makers like Microsoft.
 
Lakados said:
https://www.polygon.com/24108670/xbox-epic-games-store-phil-spencer-interview

Spencer mentioned his frustrations with closed ecosystems, so we asked for clarity. Could he really see a future where stores like Itch.io and Epic Games Store existed on Xbox? Was it just a matter of figuring out mountains of paperwork to get there?

“Yes,” said Spencer. “[Consider] our history as the Windows company. Nobody would blink twice if I said, ‘Hey, when you’re using a PC, you get to decide the type of experience you have [by picking where to buy games]. There’s real value in that.” Spencer believes console players would benefit from that freedom too — and so would console makers like Microsoft.
Click to expand...

That would be the death of the Xbox, at least as we know it. The whole point of the current model is to make money back via their store, licensing costs and online. If they allow Epic or Steam to sell, either they will undercut Microsoft's prices or Microsoft will put a fee on 3rd party stores. In which case the games will cost the same or be more expensive, rendering the entire option pointless.
 
Flogger23m said:
That would be the death of the Xbox, at least as we know it. The whole point of the current model is to make money back via their store, licensing costs and online. If they allow Epic or Steam to sell, either they will undercut Microsoft's prices or Microsoft will put a fee on 3rd party stores. In which case the games will cost the same or be more expensive, rendering the entire option pointless.
Click to expand...
Yeah but what if Microsoft essentially released a Windows version, that was as lightweight as possible designed specifically for consoles and Media centres.
Rolled it together into Windows gaming and let OEM’s and Consumers build their own consoles.

The article touches on how the selling of hardware at a loss is no longer viable because costs on the hardware aren’t coming down. So if selling the hardware at a loss to cover it with software sales doesn’t work then why not let the market decide on hardware.
 
Decko87 said:
I'm not reading all of this thread because I don't really care. If they want to make more realistic women in video games, Lara Croft and Aloy should be fucking jacked. I'm sorry, but if you spend all of your time hanging off of shit, climbing, fighting. Doing basically the hardest form of calisthenics you're going to look a bit saucy. Women and men have roughly the same muscle building potential, the main difference is the puberty we go through, and how that makes certain parts of your body more dominant. It's why women generally prefer squats to bench, exposure to estrogen tends to make you more lower body dominant. Now, there are exceptions to every rule. The best bench presser in the world, pound-for-pound is a 40 something mom named Jen Thompson who can rep 315 at like a 140 pounds of body weight (there's a formula that factors age in too to determine who the top benchers are in the world, she's either at the top or near it).
Click to expand...

Dude, you're in dire need of some biology and human anatomy classes. Muscle mass has very little to do with the strength difference between men and women. It's the type of muscle and how it functions that makes the difference. It's like the difference between a human and an orangutan... or most other primates. Their muscle mass is not the reason they can rip a mans arm off with relative ease.

Estrogen doesn't make someone more lower body dominant, if a woman prefers squats and lower body exercises it's because they like the way it makes them look, not because of estrogen. Also, the skeletal structure of a women is different than a man's.
 
grifter_66 said:
Dude, you're in dire need of some biology and human anatomy classes. Muscle mass has very little to do with the strength difference between men and women. It's the type of muscle and how it functions that makes the difference. It's like the difference between a human and an orangutan... or most other primates. Their muscle mass is not the reason they can rip a mans arm off with relative ease.

Estrogen doesn't make someone more lower body dominant, if a woman prefers squats and lower body exercises it's because they like the way it makes them look, not because of estrogen. Also, the skeletal structure of a women is different than a man's.
Click to expand...
You're wrong on both fronts, muscle mass does have a lot to do with relative strength. Yes there are plenty of strength athletes who are smaller, but they still do hypertrophy phases to increase the amount of motor units available to move a load for a particular lift. Primates muscle fibers are literally designed to be stronger than ours but not made for fine motor skills.

Second, female puberty which increases body estrogen causes your hips and femurs to widen for child birth, those areas are more well developed on a biological level. If you generally have anthropometry more aligned with hip dominant movements you're more likely to enjoy them and get better at them. On average you'll see women better at hip thrusts than bench press because they have larger pevlises and hip bones, there's just more there than their sternum and chest like men.

tldr: Having testicles and being blasted by testosterone means you grow larger on average and have more muscle mass on average.
 
Last edited:
Flogger23m said:
That would be the death of the Xbox, at least as we know it. The whole point of the current model is to make money back via their store, licensing costs and online. If they allow Epic or Steam to sell, either they will undercut Microsoft's prices or Microsoft will put a fee on 3rd party stores. In which case the games will cost the same or be more expensive, rendering the entire option pointless.
Click to expand...
How does one kill that is already dead? If Microsoft isn't selling much in games then it makes sense to push for 3rd party stores. Especially with the EU and DOJ fighting Apple over this very issue where you can only buy software from them and only them. If anything, this is a move to avoid such issues as I'm sure consoles will be next when it comes to antitrust. Also, who's to say that Microsoft wouldn't want a cut from such sales? Apple seems to be pushing for side loaded apps to pay even more money than Apple's own store. Not that I think Apple will get away with it, but I wouldn't be surprised if Phil Spenser is looking at Apple and wanting to do a monkey see monkey do.
Lakados said:
The article touches on how the selling of hardware at a loss is no longer viable because costs on the hardware aren’t coming down. So if selling the hardware at a loss to cover it with software sales doesn’t work then why not let the market decide on hardware.
Click to expand...
I don't think any console manufacturer is losing money on hardware sales. Even if they do, then it's time to sell the hardware on it's own merits and not the locked down ecosystem.
grifter_66 said:
Dude, you're in dire need of some biology and human anatomy classes. Muscle mass has very little to do with the strength difference between men and women. It's the type of muscle and how it functions that makes the difference.
Click to expand...
You think that muscle mass doesn't matter? You think the body builders are wasting their time?
Estrogen doesn't make someone more lower body dominant, if a woman prefers squats and lower body exercises it's because they like the way it makes them look, not because of estrogen. Also, the skeletal structure of a women is different than a man's.
Click to expand...
You're arguing for something that isn't even realistic to match a flawed world view. Like I said, if you want to make a women strong you don't need to argue over biology. This is a fantasy setting, so literally anything goes.

View: https://youtu.be/RDqTwSO1DDc?si=xBrB8lQ7bCy1eo9i

Men use the same cheat code too.

View: https://youtu.be/Ze94bF4N-Ww?si=bN1-nPxvVkU_Rp59
 
DukenukemX said:
I don't think any console manufacturer is losing money on hardware sales.
Click to expand...
Loss leader is a business sales technique that pretty much started with Sony's PS3, and Microsoft has apparently been doing it for some time with their own respective consoles.
The only one that doesn't do this is Nintendo, but I'm not sure on what profit percentage the Switch generates for them.

If Microsoft can't make up the loss of the consoles sold in software and license sales, then its time for them to change things up.

DukenukemX said:
You're arguing for something that isn't even realistic to match a flawed world view. Like I said, if you want to make a women strong you don't need to argue over biology. This is a fantasy setting, so literally anything goes.

View: https://youtu.be/RDqTwSO1DDc?si=xBrB8lQ7bCy1eo9i
Click to expand...

Agreed, and this was done so much better in the 1980s. :cool:
 
Manny Calavera said:
Given thier extreme policies on what Developers are allowed to say and do creatively,I am happy to hear this news.

MS/Xbox needs to die in a fire ASAP.
Click to expand...

They ate not dying in a fire, despite your desire to the contrary.
 
ManofGod said:
They ate not dying in a fire, despite your desire to the contrary.
Click to expand...
If you really are what your name on here states that you are, it should be your desire as well.
It won't be a console or platform I will ever support again.
 
DukenukemX said:
You think that muscle mass doesn't matter? You think the body builders are wasting their time?
Click to expand...
No, I said the strength differences between men and women isn't due to muscle mass not that muscle mass doesn't matter among people of the same sex.
DukenukemX said:
You're arguing for something that isn't even realistic to match a flawed world view. Like I said, if you want to make a women strong you don't need to argue over biology. This is a fantasy setting, so literally anything goes.
Click to expand...
I'm not arguing for anything, my reply to him had literally nothing to do with gaming. I don't give a shit one way or the other how a developer chooses to portray women in their game. If I enjoy the game I'll play it, if not I won't and will move on to something else. Makes no difference to me.
 
Last edited:
Red Falcon said:
DEI and Sweet Baby Inc.'s involvement.
Click to expand...
Can you give me a decent source for that?
Not trying to be pedantic but i've seen a lot of fud and wrong or exaggerated shitposting about stuff like this, so I take everything with a lot of salt.
 
Red Falcon said:

View: https://youtu.be/XDWCopJ2h8E
Click to expand...

Thanks for the link. Watched it, started ok and went downhill with logical leaps that serve only to sell what seems to be that creator's theme.
I dug a bit more for other sources and most stuff seems to hinge on people speculating the Product Inclusion Resource thing is mandatory instead of optional and exaggerating the points there, so it depends on who do you believe.
The alarming thing I found was someone that allegedly talked with 2 devs and said Microsoft was forcing them to hire Sweet Baby Inc. if true that's a huge shitty red flag. But I'll wait for more sources on that, because if it's true more ex-devs should come forward.
 
Templar_X said:
Thanks for the link. Watched it, started ok and went downhill with logical leaps that serve only to sell what seems to be that creator's theme.
I dug a bit more for other sources and most stuff seems to hinge on people speculating the Product Inclusion Resource thing is mandatory instead of optional and exaggerating the points there, so it depends on who do you believe.
The alarming thing I found was someone that allegedly talked with 2 devs and said Microsoft was forcing them to hire Sweet Baby Inc. if true that's a huge shitty red flag. But I'll wait for more sources on that, because if it's true more ex-devs should come forward.
Click to expand...
You bet, thanks for actually taking the time to watch it and give a logical assessment.
This isn't the only individual who has brought this up in the last year, and I'm starting to hear of more and more accounts of this very subject.

Each game Sweet Baby Inc. has been attached to in more than a small way has started to tank, or at a minimum bring people to its attention.
Frog in boiling pot only works if the cook doesn't crank the heat up too fast, and, well, Sweet Baby Inc. and Microsoft appear to be doing just that.
 
Lepardi said:
PS3 was 14 years for me. Bought in 2010 with BFBC2 as my main game, and now EA shut the servers down.
Click to expand...
luckily you can still play on pc thanks to the community. if you're interested just do a search i posted here how to do it back when they announced the shut down.
 
d3athf1sh said:
luckily you can still play on pc thanks to the community. if you're interested just do a search i posted here how to do it back when they announced the shut down.
Click to expand...

Perhaps my search skills are rubbish, but I can't find any such post. Is it possible for you to PM me a link?
 
ManofGod said:
They ate not dying in a fire, despite your desire to the contrary.
Click to expand...
Xbox ain't going anywhere. Maybe some people in the industry have concerns, but this is Microsoft. You going to say no to port a game to Xbox? If anything this maybe a wake up call for Microsoft to allow Windows games to run on Xbox.
grifter_66 said:
No, I said the strength differences between men and women isn't due to muscle mass not that muscle mass doesn't matter among people of the same sex.
Click to expand...
Bigger muscles are more for endurance but it also generally means more strength.
I'm not arguing for anything, my reply to him had literally nothing to do with gaming. I don't give a shit one way or the other how a developer chooses to portray women in their game. If I enjoy the game I'll play it, if not I won't and will move on to something else. Makes no difference to me.
Click to expand...
Good, then I'll be waiting for this game. Which is a shame this isn't coming to PC. Meanwhile Microsoft doesn't want curvy women in their games. If crappy games looked like this, I'd still play them. Sony gets it, and they still make their games exclusive to Playstation. They know this game will sell.
 
Decko87 said:
You're wrong on both fronts, muscle mass does have a lot to do with relative strength. Yes there are plenty of strength athletes who are smaller, but they still do hypertrophy phases to increase the amount of motor units available to move a load for a particular lift. Primates muscle fibers are literally designed to be stronger than ours but not made for fine motor skills.

Second, female puberty which increases body estrogen causes your hips and femurs to widen for child birth, those areas are more well developed on a biological level. If you generally have anthropometry more aligned with hip dominant movements you're more likely to enjoy them and get better at them. On average you'll see women better at hip thrusts than bench press because they have larger pevlises and hip bones, there's just more there than their sternum and chest like men.

tldr: Having testicles and being blasted by testosterone means you grow larger on average and have more muscle mass on average.
Click to expand...
Women have a much greater proportion of their muscle mass containing type I (slow-twitch) fibers, while men have a large proportion of type II (fast-twitch) muscle fibers. Type I fibers are longer and more fatigue-resistant than type II, but require more oxygen. Type II fibers are shorter and enable quick bursts of extreme force, but are less fatigue-resistant. It's why women excel more at acrobatics than men, and why men excel more at powerlifting than women. There is also a key difference in how abdominal muscle mass is formed in women in order to accommodate pregnancy.

So, yes, while muscle mass generally has a lot to do with relative strength, there are differences in how muscles are formed and perform between men and women that need to be recognized.
 
Red Falcon said:
DEI and Sweet Baby Inc.'s involvement.
Click to expand...



SBI absolutely, yet over 30 other small groups are doing the same thing and many for far longer then SBI and Kim Belair have been doing it.Sadly our side are behaving like the supporters of SBI.

Recent example > Bellular News Publisher 'Fellow Traveler' used them with some if its smaller studios, so guilt by association has ensued, etc.

Anyway we are at least 355k strong, and as my wife says(she does marketing for a Fortune 500 corp) and they see 600+ customers who feel the same so multiply accordingly) She is a gamer as well.Since earlt 2010s. She estimates Sweet Baby Inc DETECTED movement is so much bigger then either side has any idea. She says the gamers who dislike or even hate this ESG/DEI stuff ,wield 98% of all the power, but are very unorganized, OK, she said irs extremely unorganized. She says we need a sugar daddy with some cash to market it all.
 
Manny Calavera said:
SBI absolutely, yet over 30 other small groups are doing the same thing and many for far longer then SBI and Kim Belair have been doing it.Sadly our side are behaving like the supporters of SBI.

Recent example > Bellular News Publisher 'Fellow Traveler' used them with some if its smaller studios, so guilt by association has ensued, etc.

Anyway we are at least 355k strong, and as my wife says(she does marketing for a Fortune 500 corp) and they see 600+ customers who feel the same so multiply accordingly) She is a gamer as well.Since earlt 2010s. She estimates Sweet Baby Inc DETECTED movement is so much bigger then either side has any idea. She says the gamers who dislike or even hate this ESG/DEI stuff ,wield 98% of all the power, but are very unorganized, OK, she said irs extremely unorganized. She says we need a sugar daddy with some cash to market it all.
Click to expand...
Is this a copy pasta? Funniest thing I've read in a while.
 
saying just a PC without hurting your OEM relationship....

Cheap PC to play steam game already exist, yes an made for TV-controller out of the box interface that get your xboxfriend from the account will be more attractive than setting up steam full screen to many, but a major interesting aspect of console is the performance offer at the price specially on launch.

Either they are not that performant or they are expensive or the Xbox store become so good people use it instead of steam enough to sales really good PC at a lost at cheap price, destroying the sales of most non microsoft PC/non discrete GPU or anything that was not in it.

If you can buy a super PC for $500 that do everything that a pc do from Linux out of the box... what would it mean for the rest of the PC industry. If it is not better than what a $470 of DIY could do at launch, how it would do against a PS6...

Sure the I want a 2700x-6700xt with the psu a controller the case, 1tb ssd, 16 gig of really fast ram, wifi-bluetooth, etc... for $500 when a 2070 super alone was costing that on ebay... is super fun for customer, but what the business case here ? If they make 0 from the purchaser the rest of the way, lost a lot of money on sales and lose their OEM.

Someone in charge rapidly end up, not really a PC, just more in that direction but still locked enough that you steam-epic store on it but Microsoft still getting a taste and not easily letting you installing a non MicrosoftXbox OS on them and so on (i.e. almost exactly what they do now). Maybe there is something that work here, the just in just turn them into windows PC seem to be underrating the challenge.
 
Last edited:
LukeTbk said:
saying just a PC without hurting your OEM relationship....
Click to expand...
Microsoft is barely holding onto their OEM relationship. I don't think it matters with them owning a bunch of game studios.
Cheap PC to play steam game already exist, yes an made for TV-controller out of the box interface that get your xboxfriend from the account will be more attractive than setting up steam full screen to many, but a major interesting aspect of console is the performance offer at the price specially on launch.
Click to expand...
There aren't many prebuilt PC's that cost $500 and perform that well.
Either they are not that performant or they are expensive or the Xbox store become so good people use it instead of steam enough to sales really good PC at a lost at cheap price, destroying the sales of most non microsoft PC/non discrete GPU or anything that was not in it.
Click to expand...
Competition is good.
If you can buy a super PC for $500 that do everything that a pc do from Linux out of the box... what would it mean for the rest of the PC industry. If it is not better than what a $470 of DIY could do at launch, how it would do against a PS6...
Click to expand...
It means the rest of the industry needs to gitgud.
Sure the I want a 2700x-6700xt with the psu a controller the case, 1tb ssd, 16 gig of really fast ram, wifi-bluetooth, etc... for $500 when a 2070 super alone was costing that on ebay...
Click to expand...
I don't know about those specs being the equivalent to an Xbox Series X.
is super fun for customer, but what the business case here ? If they make 0 from the purchaser the rest of the way, lost a lot of money on sales and lose their OEM.
Click to expand...
If the Xbox is a dying platform then what money from sales? Xbox may have to compete with something beyond good exclusives. The Xbox could make it easy for consumers to choose to either play games from Steam, EA, or even Xbox. If the Xbox or Microsoft store is easier and better, then maybe consumers will go that direction? Offer lower prices, better gaming performance, or any number of things over a game bought from Steam.
Someone in charge rapidly end up, not really a PC, just more in that direction but still locked enough that you steam-epic store on it but Microsoft still getting a taste and not easily letting you installing a non MicrosoftXbox OS on them and so on (i.e. almost exactly what they do now). Maybe there is something that work here, the just in just turn them into windows PC seem to be underrating the challenge.
Click to expand...
If Microsoft does a 360 :happy: and ends up back to being a console, then they'll lose. The Steam Deck does have a desktop mode that allows users to do anything they want, including run games from competitors. Steam even allows competitors games to run through Steam's Proton. Valve seems to win consumers with just being a better service.
 
DukenukemX said:
Microsoft is barely holding onto their OEM relationship. I don't think it matters with them owning a bunch of game studios.
Click to expand...
I meant the dell-hp of the world, are they cutting the price of PC by a giant amount ?

DukenukemX said:
There aren't many prebuilt PC's that cost $500 and perform that well.
Click to expand...
Exactly they would destroy that market (or make a vastly underperforming console vs the PS6 or make a very costly one)
DukenukemX said:
Competition is good.
Click to expand...
Would almost stop to exist no ?

DukenukemX said:
I don't know about those specs being the equivalent to an Xbox Series X.
Click to expand...
Around those 6700-6700xt performance I think for most game (any faster on console than pc just do not exist in that model, they probably have to overspecs to get PS6 performance).

DukenukemX said:
If the Xbox or Microsoft store is easier and better, then maybe consumers will go that direction?
Click to expand...
Yes it could, but easier and better than steam is not that easy, outside not so just a PC like behavior.

DukenukemX said:
The Steam Deck does have a desktop mode that allows users to do anything they want,
Click to expand...
Yes people have proven that went they have choice to buy game from steam and the 512GB 4 core of zen2, 8 CU of rdna 2 cost $200 more than a series S bundle in canada and they are very not just a pc like, no one said to themselve let just buy those for the offices instead of laptop.

Are we talking about changing the personal landscape PC business by putting a near top of the line at launch option for $500 or
) We are talking about them not competing with an PS6 in games
) Not being cheap at all anymore, being like other Microsoft PC $1000+
) we are not talking about them being just a PC (that an APU-soc not upgradable like a apple M, outside adding harddrive and peripherical) at all in fact, but locked in a XboxOS in some way with microsoft trying to get a share from alternative store sales like Apple on their phone.
 
Lakados said:
Dumbed down Windows OS…
I’m tempted to try with Windows Server 2021 with the essentials version, no UI just Power Shell. See if I can get it to install the drivers and the bare minimums to make Steam run.
Click to expand...
Without the UI, isn’t it missing a lot of things that regular apps depend on? Genuine question; I haven’t worked with PS only server since an early version of Hyper-V.

IIRC, the audio subsystem is part of the GUI package as well. Be interesting if you manage it but I expect major package surgery to be required to find the correct individual bits and get them set up.
 
Lakados said:
Closer to 6600xt because of power constraints.
Click to expand...
Looking at a couple of video that 52CU seem to be really constrained yes, I imagine ranging from below 6600 to close to a 6600xt for title that run particularly well on console is more the range, but still the 6600xt alone was launched close to a complete Xbox price, you sell the controller that come with it and all the rest was almost free.
 
LodeRunner said:
Without the UI, isn’t it missing a lot of things that regular apps depend on? Genuine question; I haven’t worked with PS only server since an early version of Hyper-V.

IIRC, the audio subsystem is part of the GUI package as well. Be interesting if you manage it but I expect major package surgery to be required to find the correct individual bits and get them set up.
Click to expand...
Probably I know there is an on demand app compatibility feature that is available but I don’t know the limitations of it.

Add-WindowsCapability -Online -Name ServerCore.AppCompatibility~~~~0.0.1.0

And as part of the App compatibility you can install Edge.

And after that you can install steam.

winget install --id valve.steam --exact

Beyond that I don’t know what features are available and if they work. But it would be interesting.
 
LukeTbk said:
I meant the dell-hp of the world, are they cutting the price of PC by a giant amount ?
Click to expand...
A lot of prebuilts are built badly. They're also not cheap. An Xbox that can run PC games would be a good thing.
Exactly they would destroy that market (or make a vastly underperforming console vs the PS6 or make a very costly one)
Click to expand...
Who cares? Markets are meant to be disrupted every so often.
Would almost stop to exist no ?
Click to expand...
No. Consoles don't compete directly. PC is an open platform that anyone can compete. It's the only place where Sony, Microsoft, and even Nintendo can sell their games. Consoles act as their own market, which as we've seen with Apple is no no with EU and DOJ.
Around those 6700-6700xt performance I think for most game (any faster on console than pc just do not exist in that model, they probably have to overspecs to get PS6 performance).
Click to expand...
Spec wise yes, but realistically it's more like a 6600XT.
Yes it could, but easier and better than steam is not that easy, outside not so just a PC like behavior.
Click to expand...
It's easy to be better than Steam. Just do what they do, and better.
Are we talking about changing the personal landscape PC business by putting a near top of the line at launch option for $500
Click to expand...
PC business isn't changing, just the console industry.
or
) We are talking about them not competing with an PS6 in games
Click to expand...
They're not competing right now, and probably never will.
) Not being cheap at all anymore, being like other Microsoft PC $1000+
Click to expand...
If the Steam Deck can be cheap, so can future Xbox machines. Keep in mind that Valve isn't the only portable hand held console that's cheap. The Orange Pi Neo with it's Ryzen 8840U Processor is only $500, and it's portable. No reason Microsoft can't sell an Xbox that doesn't have a screen and battery for $500 and still profit. Make it $600 and I'm sure it'll still sell as long as people can play their choice of games.
) we are not talking about them being just a PC (that an APU-soc not upgradable like a apple M, outside adding harddrive and peripherical) at all in fact, but locked in a XboxOS in some way with microsoft trying to get a share from alternative store sales like Apple on their phone.
Click to expand...
No, we're talking about them becoming a PC. They can put a custom UI that starts Xbox games from the Xbox store, while also allowing competitors like Steam, Epic, EA, and etc to sell their own products. The writing is on the wall. This isn't just towards Microsoft, because at some point this will also include Sony and Nintendo. Much later than Microsoft, but it will happen.

View: https://youtu.be/kSwbCK2EOCs?si=IDDrNZULcN10Gvqi
 
DukenukemX said:
No. Consoles don't compete directly. PC is an open platform that anyone can compete. It's the only place where Sony, Microsoft, and even Nintendo can sell their games. Consoles act as their own market, which as we've seen with Apple is no no with EU and DOJ.
Click to expand...
Yes console, the talk is about if microsoft next Xbox is not a console, but just a PC in the shape of a console that has default setting to make tv-controller UI easy and plugin your Xbox account easy.

If they are just a PC they are an open platform, they compete directly (or they are not just a PC and it is more complicated than that)

DukenukemX said:
Who cares? Markets are meant to be disrupted every so often.
Click to expand...
Microsoft would obviously care about their relationship with OEM, the people directly in charge of deciding what the next Xbox is.

DukenukemX said:
It's easy to be better than Steam. Just do what they do, and better.
Click to expand...
Steam are a giant with decades of expertise in this and when there some legacy effect (my library of game is already there) you need to be more than better to move people, you need to be significantly better.

DukenukemX said:
PC business isn't changing, just the console industry.
Click to expand...
Why would the pc business isn't changing if the next Xbox is just a PC sold way cheaper than what you could buy for that performance ?Would it be not just a PC, not cheap or not performing close to a PS6 in games ?

DukenukemX said:
If the Steam Deck can be cheap,
Click to expand...
It is not cheap for the hardware in it.

DukenukemX said:
No, we're talking about them becoming a PC.
Click to expand...
So now they can run your office suite, visual studio, etc... out of the box and competing with the other PC reseller including microsoft themselve and cutting the price by a lot ? how can they become a PC and not changing the PC business at the same time ? Would they need to be either not that cheap or not that good for this to be possible ?
 
LukeTbk said:
Microsoft would obviously care about their relationship with OEM, the people directly in charge of deciding what the next Xbox is.
Click to expand...
What do you mean OEM? The hardware manufacturers? I don't think they care so long as they're paid.
Steam are a giant with decades of expertise in this and when there some legacy effect (my library of game is already there) you need to be more than better to move people, you need to be significantly better.
Click to expand...
You telling me that Microsoft doesn't have two decades of games on Xbox? Microsoft can find a way to make even the OG Xbox games run on PC through an emulator. The community has done it and so has Microsoft on Xbox Series.
Why would the pc business isn't changing if the next Xbox is just a PC sold way cheaper than what you could buy for that performance ?Would it be not just a PC, not cheap or not performing close to a PS6 in games ?
Click to expand...
There are already devices like this that exist in the market. The thing to understand is that consoles are not as fast as an equivalent PC. The PS5 Pro for example is going to have an incredible GPU, but with a Zen2 CPU. A CPU from 2019 and much slower than modern Zen4 and soon Zen5. Consoles are a compromise to play games cheaply. Consoles built in the 80's and early 90's were just using a variant of the 6502, which in itself is a cheaper cousin of the Motorola 6800. This continued with the use of MIPs, PowerPC, and etc. A PC with a Ryzen CPU and a dedicated GPU will still be faster and better.

View: https://youtu.be/H8K7gq0H0kg?si=seRamy48jFu7fSEf
It is not cheap for the hardware in it.
Click to expand...
It is what it is. The Deck exists. The Orange Pi Neo exists.
So now they can run your office suite, visual studio, etc... out of the box and competing with the other PC reseller including microsoft themselve and cutting the price by a lot ? how can they become a PC and not changing the PC business at the same time ? Would they need to be either not that cheap or not that good for this to be possible ?
Click to expand...
You seem to think this is a problem. There was a time period where Microsoft bought WebTV to put Windows in the living room, and here we are with Xbox that is a Microsoft product in the living room, but not running Windows. What office suite would they run on Xbox? Probably Microsoft Office 365. Who's Visual Studio? That's right, Microsoft's Visual Studio. Microsoft also makes Surface Laptops, which also compete with PC resellers. For more context, the Apple mini with the M2 CPU is $550 on Amazon. Smaller than the Xbox while also being $50 more but runs MacOS. This device works with all of Apple's products as well. This is an Apple product, which aren't known for being cheap and consumer friendly, but in this context it is compared to the Xbox. This mini PC is $600 that I randomly found from Google, has better specs than an Xbox and is smaller. The Ryzen 7 7840HS isn't better as a GPU, but it isn't meant for gaming. The 780m will do a respectable job at playing games regardless but obviously not meant for it. If Microsoft wanted to, they could do it because it's been done and being done.
 
As an Amazon Associate, HardForum may earn from qualifying purchases.
DukenukemX said:
You telling me that Microsoft doesn't have two decades of games on Xbox? Microsoft can find a way to make even the OG Xbox games run on PC through an emulator. The community has done it and so has Microsoft on Xbox Series.
Click to expand...
Microsoft wouldn’t even need an emulator, the OS itself is a stripped down Windows NT.

But the big guns are weighing in.
https://www.eurogamer.net/xbox-sets...t-technical-leap-ever-for-its-next-gen-system

Xbox president Sarah Bond had recently written to Xbox staff to reaffirm the company's commitment to hardware development – which will be welcomed news for many Xbox fans – and a plan to "future-proof" Xbox's digital libraries to "build on Xbox's strong history of delivering backward compatibility".

Xbox has "formed a new team dedicated to game preservation, important to all of us at Xbox and the industry itself".
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top