Looking forward to this "eierlegende Wollmilchsau" (all-in-one device suitable for every purpose) which is announced for november 2010.
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Eizo Foris FS2331
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The U2410 is garbage aside from viewing angles and color accuracy for industry people.
Pretty much any monitor is better for movies/games due to the U2410s medicore contrast ratio and price tag.
Pc Pro UK reviewed the Foris and stated it had 9ms of input lag, perfect motion, accurate color presets and a 2800:1 contrast ratio VS 600:1 on the U2410. Being a CPVA panel it will also have excellent screen uniformity and viewing angles. Mine should be arriving in the next day or so and I will post a review and head to head vs the BenQ EW2420/Samsung F2380MX.
Pretty much any monitor is better for movies/games due to the U2410s medicore contrast ratio and price tag.
Pc Pro UK reviewed the Foris and stated it had 9ms of input lag, perfect motion, accurate color presets and a 2800:1 contrast ratio VS 600:1 on the U2410. Being a CPVA panel it will also have excellent screen uniformity and viewing angles. Mine should be arriving in the next day or so and I will post a review and head to head vs the BenQ EW2420/Samsung F2380MX.
Nice, I look forward to your excellent reviews.
One thing if I may ask, could you take a photo of the size difference between the FS2331 and the EW2420? I know they're 23" and 24" respectively, but I'm just curious as to what they look like side by side.
Thanks
flatpanels.dk posted their review today: http://translate.google.com/transla....dk/test.php?subaction=showfull&id=1288697690
The more tests the better
The more tests the better
Thanks for linking that. Interesting review, they say it's not as fast/responsive as it seemed on paper, which is a bit of a let down considering the monitor was somewhat marketed towards gamers.flatpanels.dk posted their review today: http://translate.google.com/transla....dk/test.php?subaction=showfull&id=1288697690
The more tests the better
Turned out the Eizo was on back order for the next month so I cancelled as the price keeps coming down. Will re-order in December when they are in stock. The Flatpanels guy never gets good results as he hardly ever changes the default brightness/contrast settings so expect a much better picture.
Let me know if your unit has backlight bleed.
Let me know if your unit has backlight bleed.
dowant120hz
Gawd
- Joined
- Jun 9, 2010
- Messages
- 632
can the fs2331 do 72hz at his native resolution? (vga)
No, they had them on back order with no real ETA, that's still the case now.
I'm stuck with 3 monitors anyways. I have to buy these so I can't really afford to have a 600$ monitor sitting around.
PRAD has reviewd the Foris, it costs 2.50$ to read their review but if you are truly interested it's well worth it.
I'm stuck with 3 monitors anyways. I have to buy these so I can't really afford to have a 600$ monitor sitting around.
PRAD has reviewd the Foris, it costs 2.50$ to read their review but if you are truly interested it's well worth it.
dowant120hz
Gawd
- Joined
- Jun 9, 2010
- Messages
- 632
i have access to the prad review if you wanna know something specific
thinking about buying the fs2331 myself
but i'd have send it back if it can't do 72hz
thinking about buying the fs2331 myself
but i'd have send it back if it can't do 72hz
My Sony G520 21 inch trinitron CRT monitor is starting to play up, and I've had to dig out my old Sony E200 17 incher CRT out as a spare, in case it totally goes out. So I've been researching intensely for the past few days on an LCD replacement.
This is not the first time either, my last G520 died, and I bought a Benq V2400W and hated it. Sold it to my dad. Managed to snag another G520 a couple years back for $80AUD from a fellow OCAU forum member, and used it everyday for up to 8 hours at a time and it's been money well spent!
Main things that bothered me - ghost/trails when scrolling webpages and text around, and on the mouse. Although playing games on the V2400W were ok, FPS games even, they were fine. I also play a lot of sim racing games, and have a PS3 with GT5.
Terrible viewing angles, colour shifts when tilting head, plus the black levels were horrible.
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Just from everything I've seen and read, it looks like the Eizo Foris FS2331 ticks most of the things I want. Good black levels, colours and dynamic range. Enough inputs for my needs, although I wish it had component as I do have a PS2 I like to play once in a while, but my Component to VGA box can still be used I suppose.
I also dabble in 3D, graphics/art stuff and some video work
Just wondering if it has trails when scrolling text around? And the mouse?
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It doesn't seem like anyone here in Australia is selling it, it's on a order in basis. But the prices aren't good. I found I can get it cheaper here from Germany - they ship world wide and the prices are good. Does anyone have another shop that does it cheaper? 379 Euro
http://www.computeruniverse.net/products/e90401977/eizo-foris-fx2331-black.asp
I just hope it doesn't have any dead pixels and other issues. I'm only considering this because of Eizo's quality reputation
Just reading of all the issues with the Dell 2311 and bigger brothers has closed off that option, which would be cheaper and make more sense...
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A German video showing the ins and outs of the unit
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSOYSw6iRAE
Also found a thread with good pictures of the unit and a writeup. Showing it working with PS3, PC games, and Blu Ray movies from the PS3
And comparisons with a Viewsonic VX2450
Screen appears to be a nice semi-gloss - exactly what I want
The Googlish translation is hard to comprehend though....
http://translate.google.com.au/tran...ile01.com/topicdetail.php?f=350&t=1948231&p=1
Good viewing angles
This is not the first time either, my last G520 died, and I bought a Benq V2400W and hated it. Sold it to my dad. Managed to snag another G520 a couple years back for $80AUD from a fellow OCAU forum member, and used it everyday for up to 8 hours at a time and it's been money well spent!
Main things that bothered me - ghost/trails when scrolling webpages and text around, and on the mouse. Although playing games on the V2400W were ok, FPS games even, they were fine. I also play a lot of sim racing games, and have a PS3 with GT5.
Terrible viewing angles, colour shifts when tilting head, plus the black levels were horrible.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Just from everything I've seen and read, it looks like the Eizo Foris FS2331 ticks most of the things I want. Good black levels, colours and dynamic range. Enough inputs for my needs, although I wish it had component as I do have a PS2 I like to play once in a while, but my Component to VGA box can still be used I suppose.
I also dabble in 3D, graphics/art stuff and some video work
Just wondering if it has trails when scrolling text around? And the mouse?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
It doesn't seem like anyone here in Australia is selling it, it's on a order in basis. But the prices aren't good. I found I can get it cheaper here from Germany - they ship world wide and the prices are good. Does anyone have another shop that does it cheaper? 379 Euro
http://www.computeruniverse.net/products/e90401977/eizo-foris-fx2331-black.asp
I just hope it doesn't have any dead pixels and other issues. I'm only considering this because of Eizo's quality reputation
Just reading of all the issues with the Dell 2311 and bigger brothers has closed off that option, which would be cheaper and make more sense...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
A German video showing the ins and outs of the unit
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSOYSw6iRAE
Also found a thread with good pictures of the unit and a writeup. Showing it working with PS3, PC games, and Blu Ray movies from the PS3
And comparisons with a Viewsonic VX2450
Screen appears to be a nice semi-gloss - exactly what I want
The Googlish translation is hard to comprehend though....
http://translate.google.com.au/tran...ile01.com/topicdetail.php?f=350&t=1948231&p=1
Good viewing angles
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Well I can't wait any longer, so I've ordered it from the German site. Local Eizo dealer still hasn't got back to me, and the prices they have are all much higher anyway, even when you factor in the shipping from importing it yourself!
Just hope the monitor is 100% and not DOA, but it's an Eizo
Any other monitor brand and I wouldn't be doing this....
I considered a FW900 from Ebay, but the shipping costs an arm and leg, and the monitor is pretty tatty. There is a HP FW900 rebadge monitor as well, but they won't ship and it's in another state.
I did bid on a brand new HP LP2475w, unopened in box, guy won it as a prize. It sold for $475AUD, I was willing to bid up to $550, about the same as the Eizo Foris, but my computer crashed as the listing closed... the one that got away
Even if I didn't like LP2475W I could have sold it again with no loss, since they sell for a lot more than that.
Oh well. I'll let you guys know how the Eizo Foris is and how it looks compared to my CRT monitors. Have to say after calibrating my G520 with a Spyder 2, with Color Eyes Display Pro software, and only hitting a black level of 0.3+ maybe LCD monitors aren't so bad in the black level department, unless off course it's measured differently. My G520 is pitch black in a dark room at 50% brightness. And the Foris goes down to 0.04
Just hope the monitor is 100% and not DOA, but it's an Eizo
Any other monitor brand and I wouldn't be doing this....
I considered a FW900 from Ebay, but the shipping costs an arm and leg, and the monitor is pretty tatty. There is a HP FW900 rebadge monitor as well, but they won't ship and it's in another state.
I did bid on a brand new HP LP2475w, unopened in box, guy won it as a prize. It sold for $475AUD, I was willing to bid up to $550, about the same as the Eizo Foris, but my computer crashed as the listing closed... the one that got away
Even if I didn't like LP2475W I could have sold it again with no loss, since they sell for a lot more than that.
Oh well. I'll let you guys know how the Eizo Foris is and how it looks compared to my CRT monitors. Have to say after calibrating my G520 with a Spyder 2, with Color Eyes Display Pro software, and only hitting a black level of 0.3+ maybe LCD monitors aren't so bad in the black level department, unless off course it's measured differently. My G520 is pitch black in a dark room at 50% brightness. And the Foris goes down to 0.04
The Eizo is much better then the LP2475 so don't worry.
Pretty much any LCD beats 0.3cdm/2 even @ high brightness of 200cdm/2.
@120cdm/2 brightness the Eizo should do 0.04cdm/2 black while the HP will do 0.16cdm/2.
@Brepu
The EV2333 has a better stand and slightly better viewing angles at the cost of motion performance and input lag.
What do you guys think about numbers of static contrast of these two screens?
Any ideas?
My Sony G520 calibrated results at 2.2 gama
126cdm/2 brightness
0.332cdm/2 black level
This puzzled me though, because in a dark room, the black is way darker than my last LCD monitor Benq V2400W. A TN panel one.
according to this http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1315565
The V2400W should have way better black levels based on the number given.
Something doesn't sound right here.....
Maybe the numbers are measured differently.
Also the Benq was supposed to have 2ms GTG, but it had really bad ghosting and trails!
I just know that every LCD that has been put next to my G520 has looked subpar colour, contrast and black level wise. So I think something is a miss here with the numbers given out.
Funny thing is, the G520 does have mouse trails, you can complete a full circle of mouse pointers if you draw a quick small circle with it
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CRT's have excellent dynamic range, so when displaying a dark screen it will dim. It's the static contrast (as in measure the black value in the center of the screen that is poor), when viewing every day content and LCD will look better.
The V2400W has a poor black value accordint to DV, compare it here with the Samsung F2380M (same panel as the EV2333 but no overdrive)
http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.php?ty=6&ma1=48&mo1=365&p1=3386&ma2=36&mo2=571&p2=6293&ph=13
In the [H] Review I believe he is talking aobut minimum luminance. No TN panel can do 0.09cdm/2 black when calibrated to 140cdm/2. He later says the native contrast ratio is 900:1@135cdm/2 luminance=0.15 black which can also be seen here with the BasiCColor Validation Results.
The [H] reviewer did an excellent job, it is very rare that any site beats DV in terms of getting good calibration results
The V2400W has a poor black value accordint to DV, compare it here with the Samsung F2380M (same panel as the EV2333 but no overdrive)
http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.php?ty=6&ma1=48&mo1=365&p1=3386&ma2=36&mo2=571&p2=6293&ph=13
In the [H] Review I believe he is talking aobut minimum luminance. No TN panel can do 0.09cdm/2 black when calibrated to 140cdm/2. He later says the native contrast ratio is 900:1@135cdm/2 luminance=0.15 black which can also be seen here with the BasiCColor Validation Results.
The [H] reviewer did an excellent job, it is very rare that any site beats DV in terms of getting good calibration results
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Sure (if your monitor is in a good condition).
I donated my Trinitron several years ago. Replaced with a good LCD with same colors and better contrast.
Numbers are correct. Measured black level on some TNs is slightly below 0.1 cd/m2.
I think your own short experience with numbers tells you that CR numbers are nothing.
Technology is everything.
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How's the ghosting on the monitor? Particularly in fast paced games. Also how bad/noticeable is the black/gamma crush?
I know it's a monitor aimed at gamers/multimedia, but from what I remember from the FlatpanelsHD review, they said it didn't perform all that great.
The ghosting is very subjective i guess. I have never really gamed anything on a CRT monitor and therefor do not really know any "standards", besides ghosting is a new term to me and not something i noticed before i knew what it was
Anywho, for general use text can become quite blurry/unreadable when scrolling. So if you do alot of reading while scrolling it might not be suitable. Now in games, i must say i dont play alot of fast paced games. The main games i play are Mass Effect And World of Warcraft and i think the monitor is perfectly suitable for that, i dont really notice any problems. Might be that my eyes arent so sensitive to see it but if there are any the exceptional image quality makes up for it.
Now, the black crush does exist. But not in severe cases like shown with the samsung, the gamma shifts a bit here but it doesnt make black scenes unviewable or anything. I would say its very much acceptable, atleast i havent run into any problems yet where i have to swing my head around to get a proper look at something, which is very positive.
The guy who reviewed the screen from Flatpanels, thought great of this screen. Only reason he did not recommend it, is because he thinks 120hz is becoming the best choice for gamers now (which probrably is true). Most of he gaming recommendations are based on Hardcore gaming, and i agree that this display might not be satisfying for that kind.
Anywho, for general use text can become quite blurry/unreadable when scrolling. So if you do alot of reading while scrolling it might not be suitable. Now in games, i must say i dont play alot of fast paced games. The main games i play are Mass Effect And World of Warcraft and i think the monitor is perfectly suitable for that, i dont really notice any problems. Might be that my eyes arent so sensitive to see it but if there are any the exceptional image quality makes up for it.
Now, the black crush does exist. But not in severe cases like shown with the samsung, the gamma shifts a bit here but it doesnt make black scenes unviewable or anything. I would say its very much acceptable, atleast i havent run into any problems yet where i have to swing my head around to get a proper look at something, which is very positive.
The guy who reviewed the screen from Flatpanels, thought great of this screen. Only reason he did not recommend it, is because he thinks 120hz is becoming the best choice for gamers now (which probrably is true). Most of he gaming recommendations are based on Hardcore gaming, and i agree that this display might not be satisfying for that kind.
Is it possible to control the OSD with buttons on the monitor? I see this stupid remote control everywhere... hell I don't want this thing! I'm planning to do a mod with a Dell stand from ebay, something like this:
But without OSD buttons, the EV2333 still might be the better choice.
EDIT: is the stand completely removable or only the bottom thing that stands on the table? It looks like that on some pictures, it actually would destroy my mod.
But without OSD buttons, the EV2333 still might be the better choice.
EDIT: is the stand completely removable or only the bottom thing that stands on the table? It looks like that on some pictures, it actually would destroy my mod.
It's a steal at £912??
You must have very deep pockets for that price tag to seem good value
Thanks for all the information! Looks like I should go for the EV2333 then. My 6th replacement from Dell will arrive tomorrow, I really hope it will be at least free of dead pixels and other huge problems that I can finally give it to someone else and buy a new display for myself.
The FX2431 is indeed a nice display. But the price is pretty high for 24" - I would love to pay 1000 for the display of my dreams, but right now there isn't any display out there worth the 1000 for me.
The FX2431 is indeed a nice display. But the price is pretty high for 24" - I would love to pay 1000 for the display of my dreams, but right now there isn't any display out there worth the 1000 for me.
Sure (if your monitor is in a good condition).
I donated my Trinitron several years ago. Replaced with a good LCD with same colors and better contrast.
Numbers are correct. Measured black level on some TNs is slightly below 0.1 cd/m2.
I think your own short experience with numbers tells you that CR numbers are nothing.
Technology is everything.
Yeah there is ghosting in a high end Trinitron CRT, but it looks different, smoother, softer and more subdued, more analog if you will
There are phosphor trails that persist for quite a while, but they're quite pleasing all the same. LCD look much harsher and more digital with these types of artifacts.
It slaps you in the face with an LCD, but nobody has complained about these artifacts on a CRT
Having said that, the Dell 2709 the guy who sold me my second G520 had, looked quite good, nice viewing angles, and didn't suffer from the text ghosting that the V24002 had, at least not to the same extent. So much for "fast" 2ms GTG TN panels
That's the thing, my G520 has a nice smoother appearance when displaying images, and the colours and feel of the display is "organic", it's the analog thing. Much like an analog camera vs a cheap digital camera. Same for Analog synth vs Digital synth. The warmth and smoothness, since your not dealing in 1s and 0s, but infinite graduations.
The G520 is plenty bright anyway, it has 3 modes, Professional, Standard an Dynamic. Just changes the contrast levels. Much more brighter and contrasty than my other Sony 17 inch E200 Trinitron, which is a lower end product.
Hopefully the Eizo VA panel with impart back some of that smooth look, that 6 bit TN panels fail hard on on. From what I read, the Dell 2709 had a VA panel, nice coincidence
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Edit that German shop has already shipped out my monitor and it should arrive early next week. While my local dealer and Eizo Australia still haven't got back to me yet with a price and they said it would take 2-3 weeks from Eizo Japan..... trying to skimp on shipping I see, and they also charge more based on the other monitors they have for sale...
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