Project Money Pit (need help/advice)

Gillbot

Gillbot

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Feb 27, 2001
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I decided since this is 'murica and I just like the looks of gobs of cores and ram for no other reason than "because", I want to put together a budget (hahahah I know right!) multi-core system. Now, since I haven't put together a system since socket 1155 and lga2011 (the original), I'm looking for feedback. I'm in he tire kicking phase so I have time to browse and see what kind of numbers I'm looking at and let that guide the direction I go.

So, with browsing eBay, I've seen several dell quad socket amd g34 boards for around $100, but my concern is all the extras I'll need to make it actually run. Does anyone know what I'd be looking at picking up extra if I try to use one of these cheap quad g34 boards? Special psu? Specific risers? VRMs? (I know, lol but they were needed in the ppro era!) There are also super micro dual socket boards which are likely to run better out of the box without extras, but they are dual not quad which is a buzzkill. I've seen many amd opteron 16 core CPUs for $50 each which for a brag box, is plenty over a more powerful and exponentially more costly Intel system and pretty much what got me thinking I could build something many core for not a giant cost.

I'd be happy with mounting it in a cardboard box (yes, I have a build thread around here somewhere of my old server in a cardboard box), tossing in as much ram as I can find with whatever psu I need and calling it done if I can get away with that. It's only gonna run win server and some flavor of Linux dual boot so it really won't be tasked with doing any real work other than bragging about core and ram count to those who care. I mean, you need 64 cores for Facebook and freecell right!!!

I just don't want to try the amd/dell route if it ends up nickel and diming me to death. If I decide all the small parts/pieces are gonna add up to too much, I may just scrap the idea and go for a single socket multi core Intel powerhouse. Heck, I may opt to try a single amd g34 16 core and see how well it performs even if it isn't a powerhouse, granted it can be built on the uber-cheap.
 
What is the purpose of this build? Just personal use and you are looking at server boards?
 
Rav3n said:
What is the purpose of this build? Just personal use and you are looking at server boards?
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Yeh, just looking at wasting money on many cores and gobs of ram mostly. And most of my fears have been confirmed via Google, that board is a blade style and requires a proprietary backplane for power. I'm not opposed to soldering, but without knowing what I need to do it may be a bust already. There doesn't seem to be much info out there on this board unlike many of the other blades out there.
 
Gillbot said:
Yeh, just looking at wasting money on many cores and gobs of ram mostly. And most of my fears have been confirmed via Google, that board is a blade style and requires a proprietary backplane for power. I'm not opposed to soldering, but without knowing what I need to do it may be a bust already. There doesn't seem to be much info out there on this board unlike many of the other blades out there.
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How about you build a high end Skylake system and just send me the difference. Better results, same waste of money.
 
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I was wondering how long it was gonna take for these posts to show up. New record, you win.
 
Gillbot said:
I was wondering how long it was gonna take for these posts to show up. New record, you win.
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I bit the bait. It was clear from your OP it was a troll thread. I enjoy fun here on occasion :D

You had me at
I decided since this is 'murica and I just like the looks of gobs of cores and ram for no other reason than "because"
Click to expand...
 
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2x Intel XEON E5-2670 8 Core Each ($90-110/each)
1x SuperMicro 2P 2011-r1/2 motherboard (150-250)
8x 16GB DDR3 RDIMM ($65-75/Each)


Now if you want to go all out with cores I have a 4-Node AMD system each node consists of 16 Cores.... :) that I'm no longer using.

If you want to go "new" then get a supermicro board with warranty, and get some used ES/spicy 2011-v3 chips $350-450 will yield 14 Cores per-CPU.
DDR4 16GB RDIMM ~85-95$ for RAM on the "list" of working.
 
ToddW2 said:
2x Intel XEON E5-2670 8 Core Each ($90-110/each)
1x SuperMicro 2P 2011-r1/2 motherboard (150-250)
8x 16GB DDR3 RDIMM ($65-75/Each)


Now if you want to go all out with cores I have a 4-Node AMD system each node consists of 16 Cores.... :) that I'm no longer using.

If you want to go "new" then get a supermicro board with warranty, and get some used ES/spicy 2011-v3 chips $350-450 will yield 14 Cores per-CPU.
DDR4 16GB RDIMM ~85-95$ for RAM on the "list" of working.
Click to expand...

I'd love to go crazy with cores and ram, just don't see it as being feasible. If you get a lower cost board, they are typically for a blade and the chassis will kill you or require too much effort to get it to power up. If you get a better board, they are just insanely cost prohibitive. It looks like I may be able to do something lower core count with a super micro board dual lga2011 and maybe some luck of the draw Es chips from eBay. Still researching though and looking for feedback.

I'm leaning towards sticking to ddr3 since I've seen 16gb sticks buy it now at $50 each. Just pairing them to a board and CPU seems to be the challenge thus far. Well, the board and CPUs are cheap if you go amd and blade board, but there is no info on the chassis and nothing I've found out there on how to solder and power them on without the chassis. I had an old blade board that was lga2011 and I made my own power connector and used a 1u 800w psu to run it since I couldn't get a chassis. I'm not afraid to do that again, but these newer boards don't seem to have the pin out info readily available, or at least I haven't found it yet. I'd guess they are typical 12v power with a proprietary connector, but without the info I'm not willing to gamble.
 
Gillbot said:
Yeh, just looking at wasting money on many cores and gobs of ram mostly. And most of my fears have been confirmed via Google, that board is a blade style and requires a proprietary backplane for power. I'm not opposed to soldering, but without knowing what I need to do it may be a bust already. There doesn't seem to be much info out there on this board unlike many of the other blades out there.
Click to expand...

Literally just looking to waste money on cores and RAM, no specific purpose beyond that?
 
zadillo said:
Literally just looking to waste money on cores and RAM, no specific purpose beyond that?
Click to expand...

Other than learning and tinkering, no. I may make it do VMs and learn about more of that. Use it to setup network stuff and play/learn in a "safe" environment. I may put it to work since many cores and loads of ram takes fractions of the time my work laptop takes to crunch data, but that's few and far between plus I'd be doing it on my own since they won't chip in towards it any. I'm leaning towards a lower cost R415 or R715 now. Dual socket instead of quad but it seems to be much more reasonable cost wise.
 
Gillbot said:
I'd love to go crazy with cores and ram, just don't see it as being feasible. If you get a lower cost board, they are typically for a blade and the chassis will kill you or require too much effort to get it to power up. If you get a better board, they are just insanely cost prohibitive. It looks like I may be able to do something lower core count with a super micro board dual lga2011 and maybe some luck of the draw Es chips from eBay. Still researching though and looking for feedback.
Click to expand...

I've purchased over 2 dozen various supermicro E5 boards in the last 12 months, used and new. 2011-r1/2 and 2011-r3. I can safely say I've purchased more than a half dozen ~$100 (2P E5 r1/r2) and many more 200-250. Anything more than that was 2011-r3 and/or had 10Gig/LSI/24DIMM etc type high-end board. E5 1P boards are another store, cheapest I've gotten them $170-200, only a couple of those though as i mostly do 2P builds.


Ironically you complain about my suggestion and then end with:
"It looks like I may be able to do something lower core count with a super micro board dual lga2011"

Why would you do a SM board after you TOLD ME it was too hard and would kill me?
Why would you say a LOWER CORE when I suggested a $100 CPU that has 8 Cores?
Do you think you can buy a 4 Core E5 for $100 or less?? You're wrong.


You cannot do better than an E5-2670 for the $$$
 
ToddW2 said:
I've purchased over 2 dozen various supermicro E5 boards in the last 12 months, used and new. 2011-r1/2 and 2011-r3. I can safely say I've purchased more than a half dozen ~$100 (2P E5 r1/r2) and many more 200-250. Anything more than that was 2011-r3 and/or had 10Gig/LSI/24DIMM etc type high-end board. E5 1P boards are another store, cheapest I've gotten them $170-200, only a couple of those though as i mostly do 2P builds.


Ironically you complain about my suggestion and then end with:
"It looks like I may be able to do something lower core count with a super micro board dual lga2011"

Why would you do a SM board after you TOLD ME it was too hard and would kill me?
Why would you say a LOWER CORE when I suggested a $100 CPU that has 8 Cores?
Do you think you can buy a 4 Core E5 for $100 or less?? You're wrong.


You cannot do better than an E5-2670 for the $$$
Click to expand...

I didn't complain about your advice, but at the time I thought the 16 core amd using the Dell board was going to be the cheapest and easiest option. After more research, I see that was VERY incorrect. Also, I have yet to find lower cost super micro boards out there. Most ive been seeing were single socket and 300+. I'm not saying they don't exist, I just lack the knowledge and am not sure what to look for just yet. As I said early on, I'm in the tire kicking phase and we'll see where this leads. I had my eye on a ~$150 Dell R715 complete rack mount server that I should be able to upgrade to two of the 16 core amd chips. it comes with 32gb of ram and a pair of quad cores. If the bidding stays low, it may be an option that I can upgrade to more cores and ram later. If not, I'll lean towards the super micro e5 and see what I can get for the $.
 
AMD Cores != Intel Core

When you buy things used on ebay for a 'good price' you need to have time, if not you pay more for not being patient and waiting for the deal you want ;) I never went out looking for a board and got a deal, I waited and waited :) Find the part #s you want and wait ;)
 
ToddW2 said:
AMD Cores != Intel Core

When you buy things used on ebay for a 'good price' you need to have time, if not you pay more for not being patient and waiting for the deal you want ;) I never went out looking for a board and got a deal, I waited and waited :) Find the part #s you want and wait ;)
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I know Intel pretty much destroys amd in performance, but after being in the Intel camp up into lga2011, I'd like to try amd and see how they stack up. Even if it takes 32 amd cores and 64gb+ of ram, I'm curious to see how it stacks up against my old lga2011 system.

Now don't take that as me dismissing Intel at all! Ideally I'd like to super budget the amd rig and play but at the same time snag an Intel with patient shopping. Then I could eventually migrate over to the Intel for better performance as I aquire enough parts. Ddr3 can be used on either system so I can save by swapping that back and forth, and with the 16 core amd chips coming in at $50ish each, that's $100 for 32 cores and a good start IMHO. I just need to snag that elusive cheap board, but if that doesn't come to fruition, I'll also be keeping my eye open towards the Intel camp. Let's just see which rolls across my plate first, that'll likely decide which direction I start.

FWIW, I'm on board with the patience camp. I usually search the sold listings first to find good targets but I haven't seen any that deviated from my short term research. I did see a couple hp barebones that went pretty cheap on the amd side so I'm looking that way first. I mean, one had 64gb of 1333 ddr3 in a 8x8gb config paired with dual 8 core amd chips and sold for under $150. I would have snagged that in a heartbeat since the ram alone was nearly worth the asking price! That would be a good tinker toy while I source an Intel board and CPUs, then when that happens steal the ram from the amd and swap over.

I know I seem like I have horrific adhd (I prob do) but there is some method to my madness I think. Oohhhh, look shiny stuff, brb!
 
ToddW2 said:
AMD Cores != Intel Core
Click to expand...

Also, care to expand more? Are we talking pure performance? Ghz per ghz? I know traditionally that ghz per ghz, Intel does far better but what I'm looking for is say $/$ and core/core, is there some point that you can equal the playing field?

Say compare a $50-75 e5 Intel to the opteron 16 core 6272 (or whatever it is) that can be had for the same $50-75. I'm not trying to justify amd, just trying to learn and understand.
 
Ok, more reading leads me to believe that the Intel 8c/16t still outperform the amd 16core CPU, correct? So dual 8c Intel with ht will still likely outperform two 16c amd chips? Since amd doesn't have ht, or am I mistaken there?
 
silent-circuit said:
You're correct.
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Yeah, the more I read, the more I learn. I still am going to keep an eye on the amd camp and if I see one like the last I saw, I'd be silly to pass it up as to me it's like buying the ram and getting the amd system free. Aside from that, I think I'm going to try my best to aim for an lga2011 setup and shoot for the Xeon e5 as suggested.
 
For Sandy bridge avoid Bx stepping chips, Ivy bridge is different as there are lots of different steppings but generally stepping codes starting QExx or QFxx will be better
 
Nathan_P said:
For Sandy bridge avoid Bx stepping chips, Ivy bridge is different as there are lots of different steppings but generally stepping codes starting QExx or QFxx will be better
Click to expand...

Thanks for the tip. I think I'm goi g to shoot for the e5-2670 as was suggested earlier since they are reasonably prices and not an es. Though, if something Es came along and I could make it work, I won't shy away from it.
 
Ended up with a deal on a supermicro board and pair of chips I couldn't pass up. 24 processing cores and 48gb ram total, not bad.
 
ToddW2 said:
2x Intel XEON E5-2670 8 Core Each ($90-110/each)
1x SuperMicro 2P 2011-r1/2 motherboard (150-250)
8x 16GB DDR3 RDIMM ($65-75/Each)


Now if you want to go all out with cores I have a 4-Node AMD system each node consists of 16 Cores.... :) that I'm no longer using.

If you want to go "new" then get a supermicro board with warranty, and get some used ES/spicy 2011-v3 chips $350-450 will yield 14 Cores per-CPU.
DDR4 16GB RDIMM ~85-95$ for RAM on the "list" of working.
Click to expand...

Im so tempted to say "sign me up." i havent had a 2P system for a while. maybe when i finish school and start crunching again.
 
Why don't you try and work out how to get a system with maximum CPU power for minimum wattage? This is always a good project and challenging to boot
 
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